Where Bob Dylan Rehearses Before Tours
Bardavon Director Chris Silva talks hosting private Dylan rehearsals—including before 'Modern Times'
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When people were interviewing me about my book, one question I got a lot was: “What did you learn that surprised you?” One answer I remember giving a few times: How hard Dylan rehearses before tours. Despite his reputation as flying by the seat of his pants onstage, he drills his bands before each leg—even if the songs they rehearse may not be the songs they play at the actual shows.
One of Dylan’s favorite places to rehearse in recent years is in the Hudson Valley. He has rehearsed six times at two sister venues, the Bardavon 1869 Opera House in Poughkeepsie and the Ulster Performing Arts Center (UPAC) in Kingston, three at each. Most have been before tours that begin on the East Coast or in Europe, but one was preparing to record an album: Modern Times, which he subsequently recorded at Clinton Studios in nearby New York City.
I spoke with Bardavon/UPAC Executive Director Chris Silva to learn more about Dylan’s rehearsals at his venues. After 30 years, Silva just stepped down from running the place, though he will continue to help with programming. He told me about Dylan’s half-dozen secret visits to the two theaters, as well as some other artists who rehearse there.
How did that first rehearsal in 2006 come about?
Just a relationship with an agent that we had worked with a lot. I got a cold call and [the agent] said, “I got an artist who wants to rehearse for a few days. He needs some privacy.” I said, “OK, who is it?” He wouldn’t tell me.
I said, “Okay… Can you give me the dates?” So I checked it all. Then I said, “I can’t really confirm this until you give me some idea of what we’re talking about.” He said something like, “Don’t think twice. It’s alright.” I went, “Ah!”
That’s a good clue.
And that was it. We booked it, and then they came in.
I’m a lifelong fan. When that became real, I was like, “Holy shit, really? Rehearsing? How awesome!” The first time he came, he was writing Modern Times. He was in my theater for like five days with the band and a bunch of guys, and they were writing new Bob Dylan songs. It was something I could have never dreamed in a million years I’d get to do.
The other times we’ve had him, six times now, it’s all tour rehearsal. But that first time, he was writing the music. I mean, I was hearing “Nettie Moore” being created.
You’re able to hear this just from your office?
I was sitting in the wings. I positioned myself. I made sure that I was the essential human being that had to be on the stage if anybody needed anything.
In the second rehearsal, 2008 or something, he did one “performance” in an empty space facing the audience, with a band, of “Hollis Brown.” They were just working it out.
So is it set up as if it’s a concert?
Not really. Everything’s kind of tucked upstage. It’s not usually with a sense of performance at all. But if Dylan decides to perform, that’s what he’s going to do.
It’s interesting that they still came this last time [Fall 2022] before they went to Europe, even though it was now the same songs they’d been playing for a full year.
They do that on every tour. It’s exactly the same. He just loves to work. They’re not really rehearsing the show. I don’t think that’s the sense of it. I think it’s just play. They could be playing Grateful Dead tunes.
I mean, Dylan may have something in his mind to work on. The guys show up, and they don’t really know what is going to happen. They could rehearse a song, and then the song would change when they do the show. That happens with a lot of artists. I don’t think it’s that unusual, especially somebody like him who’s always changing it up anyway.
I’ve talked to a bunch of musicians in his bands and one throughline is how intensely they rehearsed. When I first heard it I found it a bit surprising, because Bob has the reputation of, you know, “he’s winging it.” But clearly the rehearsals are serious, and they’re before every single tour, even if he’s playing the same songs with the same people as last time.
Yeah. Who does that? I’m not saying artists don’t rehearse before they tour. They do. But he’s pretty religious about it, and it’s all business. He’s working when he’s there. He’s not hanging out. He’s working.
After that first time, we started a relationship with Al [Santos] and the people who make stuff happen for him. It’s been a great 18-year relationship. We’ve become close to these guys because we’ve come in contact with them pretty much every other year, whether they’re rehearsing or not. I mean, Tony Garnier lives in the neighborhood, more or less. So we know each other.
We also did a couple of shows with them in Kingston at the Hutton Brickyards, I think it was in '17, two shows back to back.
Is that like a sister venue to the Bardavon and UPAC?
It was just for Dylan’s two concerts. We did not get along with the owner of the property. We had actually two other concerts we were bringing, Willie Nelson and somebody else, but we said, “Nah, it’s too much. This isn’t fun.”
But the Dylan shows were great. Al and their whole crew were so helpful, because we were really creating a venue out of nothing. It was an old brick factory, right on the Hudson River. A really beautiful spot. There had never been a venue there. We wanted to make sure that our plan was going to work, and they came out early on their off day.
That’s when he was doing those standards. At the end of the show, I was standing next to a friend. I knew what the setlist was, so I said, “This is his last song.” She said, “God, I wish he’d done ‘Blowin’ in the Wind.’” And I said, “He just did.”
We added a second show too, because the first one sold out. The funny thing about that is we had to work a little harder to sell it. Al’s comment was, “Well, that first sandwich is so good. But that second sandwich, sometimes you just can’t have it.”
Have you ever put in a pitch for Bob to play the Bardavon, or is it too small?
Oh, fuck yes. Are you kidding? Constantly!
In fact, once, I can’t remember which time it was, we were talking about it while they were in the room—even though they were about to tour. But it was a U.S. tour, so I think I was just talking to his manager about it. Then they exited, and I overheard Bob say, “Well, are we gonna play this place or not?”
It ended up being not. But for two seconds, I was like, “Oh my God, did it happen?”
We were holding dates in November [2022] to follow the tour they were about to launch. But Al called and said they put four dates in London on sale and it sold out in like five minutes, so they were kind of forced to add more shows in Europe. So they extended the tour into November, and that clicked off the ever-changing unknown number of performances that they’re going to do every year.
But the plan was to come back from Europe and do a little bit of U.S. stuff, starting with us. We had two shows. It was going to be wonderful.
I’ve been looking up other places he’s rehearsed. It does seem like a lot of the time, it’s just wherever opening night is. Like they’ll book some small theater for three days—the first two are rehearsal, then the third night they open it up and it’s the first show of the tour.
That’s the ideal. That’s what I would hope he wanted to do. Who knows? I’m hoping I get a call in the beginning of the year saying, “Okay. It’s happening.” UPAC, our Kingston theater, is fifteen hundred seats. It makes more sense economically.
What happened at the Rough and Rowdy Ways rehearsals in Fall 2022?
He was at UPAC. What I remember is they really liked the proximity of the bus to the stage door, which cracked me up. Because he was already 80. He didn’t take long walks anymore. Almost every time we’ve had him, this goes back 20 years, he would take these walks with his bodyguard. Not anymore.
The band was all close together, sitting around and taking notes while they played. But they didn’t really play Rough and Rowdy at all. They played a lot of Dead that time. They usually work for like three hours, maybe more, depending on what they’re doing. It’s always late afternoon.
Tony Garnier said this years ago to me: “We rehearse and rehearse and rehearse. Then whatever song we’re rehearsing, we go onstage and change it.” You’ve heard these stories a million times from all the musicians. It’s so unpredictable.
I think the cat just likes to work and play. That’s how he prepares for what is actually a grueling thing. Even though I’m sure he travels in as much luxury as he can, it’s hard to tour and perform in your 80s.
We’ve had a huge offer on the table for them for years. We periodically check in with the booking agent, but it doesn’t ever pan out. And, you know, tick tock. How many tours does he have left? But the comfort is, the next would probably be the United States.
Are you going to have mixed feelings if he finally plays there once you’ve retired?
Nah, I’ll be there. I’m retiring, but we’re still going to program. I just don’t want to be the boss anymore.
You had that story of being blown away by “Nettie Moore” years ago. Any musical moments you overheard in the Rough and Rowdy rehearsals that stuck with you?
I think just the fact that they played so much Dead.
It’s also difficult [to hear]. I’m no longer positioned offstage left, which just doesn’t work anymore.
Why not?
It’s just their vibe. They’re like, “Who’s that guy?” I don’t want to push it. I’ll go visit Al, who’s offstage. We chit chat, and often he’s like, “Bob’s coming out”—meaning, get lost.
How do you sense the band working during these rehearsals? Are there instructions being given?
Very little. I think occasionally he says something to Tony, or to everybody, but often he might just say a title, or he’ll just start playing. I’m not close enough to them to go, what’s the signal that he’s giving Tony? I mean, Tony’s the one that’s ultimately responsible for figuring out what’s going on and to relay that to the other musicians. His pad is full of notes, chord changes, etc.
Everybody’s on their toes, really. I mean, it’s relaxed, but they’re very focused, because that’s the way that Dylan is.
I remember they had a funky little upright piano, and then he played guitar for a while. He sat with his electric guitar, which nobody really sees much of anymore. So that was cool.
When you’ve got a super famous person doing this sort of secret rehearsal, do you have to beef up security? What’s the protocol?
They have their own security. I mean, obviously nobody’s allowed in the theater, but everything in our operation is separated. It’s in the same building, but not in the theater. So it’s not that tricky, surprisingly.
Also, it’s anonymous. I mean, we always have buses parked here. So people just think it’s some show going on. Even if it’s like four or five days in a row, no one knows what’s going on in there. It’s pretty safe. That’s one of the reasons I like it here. You’re right in the middle of everything in a pretty bustling town, but the stage door’s on the side street for both theaters. It’s very easy to be anonymous.
When he used to take walks, he also dressed in the disguise. The hoodie, layers, giant sunglasses and stuff. So it’s hard to detect.
What’s the difference between Bardavon and UPAC for these rehearsals? He’s done them at both places.
Three of each. What’s the difference? Not much. The load-in is very simple, and they just bring rehearsal gear when they’re doing this stuff. It’s not their show set up. They’re not in our PA. They do have front-of-house set up, so the guys can play, but it’s all them. It’s self-contained.
So what makes the determination, it’s at one venue versus the other?
Good fucking question. I have no idea. It’s all them.
Access to wherever they’re going next is not an unimportant thing. In terms of where they’re sleeping at night, I don’t think that matters, but the proximity in both cases to the thruway or the airport or wherever it is they need to be is part of the decision.
It’s like that story I told you when they were seriously talking about doing the show at the Bardavon, which would be an amazing underplay for him. I literally heard him say, “Jeff, we gonna play this place or not?” And then it was not. Who knows why? I have no idea. It’s a funny business. I mean, how hard would it have been to set up everything? You’re already there.
If they’re doing a U.S. tour, if it starts on the East coast, then they would rehearse with us or somebody like us. So they travel once, do their rehearsal, then they get on their bus and they go. That’s generally the routine. There’s never like a rehearsal, then fly someplace. Except if you’re going to Europe.
So we miss all the tours that start on the West coast. We’re not going to get them in any way, shape, or form. Or Japan. But we’ve gotten three Europe rehearsals now.
But I’m telling you the first time, man, when he was writing Modern Times, I was like, “Holy mackerel, this is so awesome.”
Did you know that’s what he’s doing going in? “Bob’s here working up a new album.”
That’s all I knew. I don’t think there was a title yet. But I did know, “Is he touring?” “No. He’s rehearsing before he goes into the studio.” Then he went to the city after he rehearsed with us and recorded it. It was pretty close to the bone.
When was the last time he rehearsed there pre-pandemic?
He rehearsed in '19, at UPAC in Kingston. I can’t remember what it was for. I think it was March of '19. Where was he then?
That would have been another pre-Europe tour rehearsal, it looks like. Just like he did in Fall '22.
Exactly. You know, he’s a man of pretty strict habits. But he’s got a work ethic, no question about it.
And a great band, every time we’ve had him. I mean the first band was the Modern Times band. And then we got Sexton; he was there a couple times. Super nice guy. And Tony, of course, always.
Last time you had a couple of new people since the 2019 one.
That’s why Al sent us a hospitality rider. Because we always try to make it like a show situation, so that they have all the conveniences they would like to have.
So you get a rider just like an actual show?
They don’t ask for anything, because it is rehearsal, and they don’t have an expectation, but we’re like, “No, just give us a rider. We’ll do the basics.” Just snacks and beer and wine. Whatever they would normally expect to see at their job.
Maybe if there’s any setlist changes, you’d get a preview of them before the European folks.
You never know. But like I said, who knows what they’re going to rehearse? They could just do all Johnny Cash covers. It’s very unpredictable. I mean, his stuff is obviously there, but it does not seem to be the only thing they’re playing, that’s for sure. Some of it is jamming, playing, getting in the mood.
You ever hear something and then you have to go Google to find out what it is?
Totally. A lot of it’s mysterious, because he’s not necessarily singing out. So often you have to get it from the cadence and whatever the melody is, then try to pick it up. Like “Nettie Moore,” I do remember that song so vividly because the end recording was not that far from the rehearsal, which was sort of a talk song. I remember I was emailing my daughter going, “I think he said ‘down like hail’ or something.”
Are artist rehearsals a big part of the business for you?
We host a lot of rehearsals. I mean, we really aggressively court artists as much as we can, especially if there’s some natural affinity or they live nearby. Right now, we’re really trying to get Regina Spektor who lives in the neighborhood to notice that this is a place where she can develop something. Pete Seeger, we did too many projects to count. Natalie Merchant lives nearby. We’ve done a dozen rehearsal weeks with her.
Patti Smith plays a show for us every fall. The first time Patti played here, I think it was just after her tour opening with Dylan [in 1995], Natalie Merchant jumped on stage towards the end of the show. Me and one of the stagehands were in the wings. We took took like two steps towards the stage to take this person off. And then we saw, oh, it’s Natalie Merchant. She did a duet with Patti on “Because the Night,” which was fabulous. Then she just ran off into the wings.
Patti, who is very blind without her glasses, didn’t know who it was. When Natalie ran off, Patti said to the audience, “Oh, those Vassar girls.” She just assumed it was some wild student who jumped onstage.
We ended up giving Natalie a ride home because her car broken down, and that kind of began that connection.
We’re working with Jack DeJohnette, a great jazz drummer, percussionist, multi-instrumentalist. He lives in Woodstock, and his wife Lydia contacted us and said, “Jack’s turning 80. He doesn’t want to tour anymore, but he has a list of friends he’d love to play with. Can you work together?” He listed Jon Batiste, Santana, Paul Simon, Savion Glover, all kinds of people. And we’ve done eight events with him now since that call.
We did this tribute to Miles Davis, and Carlos Santana and the entire Living Colour band and five other great jazz musicians from the city came up. There were three full kit drum sets on the stage; three guitarists, including Carlos; two keyboards. one timpani player. It was unreal.
We’re actually having dinner with them tonight to talk about what’s next. Because he’s been talking to Paul Simon. Like, “Okay, Paul Simon sounds good!” Jack’s just one of the greats.
I’m a big Weird Al fan. The one time I went to the Bardavon was when he opened his first Vanity Tour there in 2018. He opened another tour there again a few years later. Was that the same situation, rehearsing there first?
Yeah. They rehearsed for like four days. The reason is the manager lives in Hudson Valley and loves the Bardavon. That’s why it happened. Weird Al in a 900-seat theater is super unusual. I mean, he’s doing deep cuts, as you know. It wasn’t your typical Weird Al show. But who cares?
Deep cuts probably needed extra rehearsal.
They rehearsed a lot. They were real specific with what they were doing, unlike Bob who’s more like jamming.
Emo Phillips opened. What a trip that guy was. I was in my office. Emo comes up looking for me. “I’m sorry…are you the master of ceremonies?” “Yeah, I guess you can call me that.” “I’ve written you an introduction.” And he wrote this whole joke for me. [It began, “Emo Philips is easily one of America’s comedians. He is considered by many.” and so on]
He was just so sweet. He’s like his stage persona. And Al, too, for that matter. Those are sweet gigs, because they’re total road warriors, but they’re nice. They like what they do.
Thanks Chris! Obviously I have no footage or audio or anything of Dylan’s private rehearsals here, so here’s Weird Al performing his Dylan pastiche “Bob” at the Bardavon:
“obviously”
Wonderful interview with Chris Silva. I have seen concerts at both venues (UPAC and Bardavon) and indeed they would be perfect venues for Dylan, especially knowing his love of vintage "opera houses." I also attended Bob Dylan's concert at the Hutton Brickyards, which in spite of the difficulties Chris mentions, was a terrific show in a gorgeous setting.